Making Cents of the Ball - The Golf Ball Industry

First let me say that this is just dipping a toe into a $1.31 BILLION market!  Yes!  I am talk about golf balls.  Not golf...just golf balls.  Mike Padron from the Tin Cup Club joins the show to talk about how consumers make choices when it comes to what balls to purchase and play as well as what factors can and should go into that decision.  

Market Size and Growth

• The global golf ball market was valued at approximately $1.31 billion in 2022 and is projected to grow at a CAGR of 2.4% from 2023 to 2030.
• Factors like the promotion of golf tourism, construction of new golf courses, and rising disposable incomes are key drivers of this growth.

Revenue Streams

• Professional Tournaments: Events like the PGA Tour and U.S. Open generate significant demand for high-performance golf balls, accounting for a large share of industry revenue.
• Recreational Golf: The growing popularity of golf as a leisure activity contributes to consistent sales, especially among amateur players.

Key Trends

• Technological Advancements: Innovations like multi-layered golf balls and seamless cover technology enhance performance, driving consumer interest.
• Sustainability: There is a rising demand for eco-friendly and biodegradable golf balls, aligning with global sustainability goals.
• E-commerce Growth: Online sales channels are expanding, making golf balls more accessible to a broader audience.

Challenges

• High Initial Costs: The cost of golf equipment, including balls, can deter new players, particularly in developed markets.
• Declining Interest Among Youth: In some regions, younger generations show less interest in golf, impacting long-term market growth.

The industry is poised for steady expansion, supported by innovation and increasing global participation.

Golf ball fitting, from a financial perspective, is an investment that can yield significant returns for both golfers and manufacturers. Here's how it plays out:

For Golfers:

1. Performance Optimization: Proper fitting ensures golfers use balls tailored to their swing and playing style, improving accuracy and distance. This can reduce the need for trial-and-error purchases, saving money in the long run.
2. Cost Efficiency: While fitting services may have an upfront cost, they help golfers avoid spending on unsuitable balls, ultimately lowering overall expenses.

For Manufacturers:

1. Revenue Growth: Offering fitting services can attract more customers, increasing sales of premium golf balls.
2. Brand Loyalty: Personalized fitting experiences foster customer loyalty, encouraging repeat purchases.
3. Market Differentiation: Companies that provide fitting services, like Bridgestone and PING, stand out in a competitive market, enhancing their reputation and profitabilit

Transcript

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Jesse Stakes: Hey, everybody! Welcome to this week's episode of making sense of it all. I have Mike Padron from the Tin Club Club joining me. I think we could probably call this episode making sense of the ball. What do you think

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Mike Padron: Absolutely. Yeah. I appreciate you having me. Man.

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Jesse Stakes: Yeah, man, thank you so much for joining me. We were talking about this. We've talked about it for a couple of months, but talking about golf balls and like how much of an industry it's become. And it's, you know, it's crazy. Because in doing some research for this episode, you know, the golf ball market alone has become a 1.3 1 billion dollars industry as of 2022. So imagine where it is 3 years later. But does that surprise you to hear that number

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Mike Padron: Not really. I mean, you think about it. You're you're out there, and most people are gonna lose.

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Mike Padron: I mean, I would think 5, 6 7 balls around, and you're paying 40 $45 a dozen times. However much golf has blown up since Covid. I can't imagine how many.

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Mike Padron: how often people are buying just dozens and dozens of balls. I mean, obviously, I I do it as well. But that does. That doesn't surprise me. It's a huge number, but it does not surprise me, at least

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Jesse Stakes: Well, I'll tell you really where, where you know. Kind of sparked this conversation between you and I. Even as far back as the fall was. I had gone to Vegas, and I had rented clubs, and I was just. I brought some golf balls with me that I normally play, just to make sure I had something, and I could carry it in my carry on, but I ended up finding it randomly a noodle neon on the course.

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Jesse Stakes: and I couldn't lose it as bad as I hit it as hard as the wind was blowing. It just wouldn't get lost, and I was, and it made me think I'm like, am I playing the right ball for myself here, like I, you know, I grab a pro v. 1, or pro v. 1 x, or you know something that's a premium golf ball and think, okay, well, I'm playing a better ball just because of the price point. And for in the you know. What they say is, you know, valuable about it, but then it just made me question it, or it made me at least think about

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Jesse Stakes: it. So you know, we've been going back and forth on this for a while. So I said, Why don't we just lay something down, actually kind of put our put our thoughts out there

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Mike Padron: No, absolutely, and that's the worst thing I've done that several times.

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Mike Padron: And that's what got me into the whole ball. Golf ball, rabbit hole was, I found, a ball

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Mike Padron: at a course, and I played

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Mike Padron: 6 holes with it. I was doing a match at a time. I came back, and I beat the guy, and I was like I was like, Oh, man.

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Mike Padron: like I've never played. I've never played this bridgestone in my life. And all of a sudden

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Jesse Stakes: Here we go!

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Mike Padron: And I kept it the whole rest of the round never lost it. It was it was crazy.

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Mike Padron: But yeah, I mean. I I think there's something to it. I think that's what kind of sparked this whole conversation. I think they're premium for a reason, and and that's kind of what we wanted to kind of jump on and talk about was that

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Mike Padron: you know? Where do you? Where do we see the differences, and where do we see it? What fits, what and what ball fits? Who and it's

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Mike Padron: it's it's confusing at times, believe me, I mean, I've I've been there, and I'm I'm lucky enough to have a little simulator in my garage, and I'll throw some numbers out there, but so I can actually do apples for apples.

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Mike Padron: But I can't imagine if you don't have access to any of that you're just. You're just out there saying, like you just said, Hey, I didn't lose it for 9 holes. It must be a perfect ball, like I'm just gonna keep going, so it may not be

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Jesse Stakes: Yeah, I mean, like for me, I think about it sometimes because what works for me around the greens, or what I think is really good with a wedge doesn't necessarily always translate to a driver for me. So it's I feel like I almost have to.

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Jesse Stakes: I have to pick or choose but it. But I guess along those lines, 1st thing I'd ask you is, you know, how did you decide what golf ball you wanted to play like what you know. What was it? And and I don't mean when you started getting granular on it. I meant at first, st like when you 1st started playing golf. You 1st started getting getting better at it. What were the factors that made you choose a golf ball

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Mike Padron: My very 1st time, I mean, like, where I've actually thought of a golf ball before I would just go. I would just go grab whatever's on sale, and

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Mike Padron: and just grab as many as I can. And I I don't really care. But then, once I started really looking into it, I think at 1st was the price. I mean, we were spending so much money on rounds and

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Mike Padron: clubs and everything else like, why am I gonna spend $50 a dozen to pretty much lose them all because I wasn't as good of a stick back then, and I was losing balls like crazy and that's kind of where that started. I think it was a lot price. And obviously we fell into some of the marketing stuff on. You know, Titleist, this must be the best ball out there. I'm not gonna pay for a pro v 1. So I'm gonna go for a you know tour, soft, or whatever the forget. The one down is from there.

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Mike Padron: but that's kind of where that started. It was mostly price at that point, and then kind of changed as I got a little better at the game.

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Jesse Stakes: Yeah, well, and I kind of argue kind of the same. And I even would even say I went kind of a step further. I mean, like I was. My father-in-law lived on a golf course. And so basically, everything that he like got out of out of his yard that came into his yard. That's what I would play, I mean, I didn't, really. I wasn't married to any brand

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Jesse Stakes: I did see the value in a urethane cover because it would spin, and it would kind of, you know, make me feel cool when it would check up on the green like when I 1st started playing so like I felt that, you know that was that was a value point to me was was in just kind of like being able to do something cool with the ball, or like almost like a trick in a way.

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Jesse Stakes: and that I was enamored with it like when I 1st started playing golf. I was so focused on hitting flop shots or trying to trying to get a ball to check up that that was like I didn't care about anything else. If I could hit a wedge that would one hop and skip, or if I could hit a ball way up in the air and get it to, you know, trickle out. I was happy

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Mike Padron: I still remember, like I was playing Julian Creek the 1st time I ever spun a ball back, and I don't. I think it was just a really thin wedge shot that I did not know. I was probably at that time found a tour below, and I remember I remember it hit and like spun back. And I'm like, I'm really good at golf now.

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Mike Padron: like, and it's just it just happened to be that it was pro. I I almost positive those a tour of a lot of, because I fell in love with those walls, and they were so wrong for my game. But it was just that's what being used at the time. And it was

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Mike Padron: that's funny that you say that, because that's exactly how I was like, okay, well, now I need a ball that can do that all the time, and it's right

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Jesse Stakes: Mike, the 1st time I ever spun a ball back is because it fell off the side of a mountain. I mean it just

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Mike Padron: You have a lower trajectory, anyway. So

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Jesse Stakes: Okay.

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Mike Padron: Yeah, it's gonna be hard for you to spin a lot back. But I hit the ball so high it's just I just gotta put a little spin on, and it's gonna it's gonna come back. But

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Jesse Stakes: Well, let's talk about fitting. Let's talk about fitting tools, though, because it's like that's 1 of those things there. There is a lot out there now, just from a like, even if you're a consumer who's got a who's got access to the web. There are fitting tools out there. I think almost every major ball manufacturer and even a lot of the smaller ball manufacturers have some sort of an online fitting tool. And I think, like you said, there's equipment that can help you fit to it as well. So you know.

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Jesse Stakes: Tell me about that a little bit. Do you use those online tools like when you've kind of gone through your process. Do you look at what those ball manufacturers offer through online

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Mike Padron: I have, so I've done. I've done the tireless one. I've done the Callaway one. I've done the richtone.

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Mike Padron: and I pretty much know going in when I put my parameters, what they're gonna give me, which one is because I've done enough research with them.

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Mike Padron: And then this year, for the 1st time I I used the ball Namic, on ballfitting.com. It's I think it's a ping

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Mike Padron: owned company. Okay.

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Jesse Stakes: Ping owners.

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Mike Padron: So they're they're not involved in balls at all. So

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Mike Padron: for them to be able to do this and kind of

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Mike Padron: be outside looking in it was kind of cool. And you put in, basically, I started putting in all my preferences. I actually can put in numbers from

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Mike Padron: all my spin rate numbers my distances that I have on the

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Mike Padron: on my sky track and go from there, and it spits out some pretty good. I mean

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Mike Padron: pretty good numbers as far as how much of a percentage is a match like

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Mike Padron: the last one I did I just looked at was the Wilson Staff model was the highest match for me at 95.7. So obviously, that's gonna change. If I say, you know, Greenside spin is the most important to me. It may give you it. Tyler's probably one X might be the biggest one, or if I say I can't, I gotta have it no spinning off the T. It might give me a, you know, Bridgestone, Bx, or something something completely different. So obviously, the preferences change a little bit, but it's but it always fits it. I did it 3 times

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Mike Padron: cause you buy a little 3 pack of them. You do have to buy it, so I will say you can't. It's not just a free fitting you have to purchase it. You can buy packs of them so you can do them and redeem them down the road, and I bought a 3 pack, did it 3 different times

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Mike Padron: and every single time it came out with the same 3, and then the 4th ball was always kind of a mix. It always came out with Wilson Staff model, Callaway chrome tour strix on Z. Star Xv. And then

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Mike Padron: and then a sprinkling of one time. It was pro v. 1 x. One time it was the Tour Bx. So it just depend on what I did, the preferences of. But those other

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Mike Padron: the 3 ball where the 3 balls that kept kept popping up for me. And that was that ball fitting.com. It's it's pretty cool. I never used it before. It shows you like kind of charts of the ball flight according to your stats or your numbers if you use this ball. This was that's what it's gonna look like in the air, obviously with a perfect swing and a perfect day. And then it kind of you can see when one comes in steeper than the other. It's it's it's pretty cool. It does a good job

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Jesse Stakes: Very cool. I actually for the. For in preparation for this, I I went on.

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Jesse Stakes: God, I went on Titleist website, Bridgestones, Calloway's

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Jesse Stakes: vices. And I also did one ball, namic fitting, and I did everything intentionally exactly the same. I put in all the exact same data for each one of them, or as closely as I could, because some of them ask a little bit different questions.

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Jesse Stakes: With the exception of I did titleless's twice, because one time I said price mattered. The other time. I said it didn't matter, and I found it very interesting, because I felt like I got a hodgepodge of all kinds of different stuff, not the lob bombs here. I'm not trying to, I'm not trying to, you know. Blow up people's fitting tools or anything. But I mean titleist went from a tour soft to a Pro. v. 1 when it didn't, when price didn't matter.

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Jesse Stakes: Ballnamic fit me to a pro v. 1 x. Where

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Jesse Stakes: titleists themselves fit me to a Pro. v. 1. And then Bridgestone went

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Jesse Stakes: much cheaper. Actually, they actually said, Play the E 12 straight. And I actually messed with that one a little bit, just to say, Well, if I change this change that, and they're like, Nope, play the E 12 straight like they would not leave. They would not leave that golf ball, they said, this is where you should be.

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Jesse Stakes: Callaway gave me the chrome soft, and then I did vice for one of the smaller manufacturers, because I know that they are an up and coming company, and they they have a pretty decent ball fitting tool, and they gave me their their vice pro air, and then, as a second choice, their vice pro. So what I felt like was, is that I'm like, okay, I I took the same information and went to different manufacturers, and they kind of threw me all over the map

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Jesse Stakes: and like. And it was like, I didn't feel necessarily that I had clarity of choice at the end of it. But I did feel like, it's like, Okay, if I'm going to try some golf balls. I felt like I knew, like, you know, probably 5 sleeves of golf balls that I was going to buy to try after that

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Jesse Stakes: sounds like you had a

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Mike Padron: Pause here.

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Jesse Stakes: Sounds like you had a little bit more, a little bit more kind of solidarity, and what you got as far as your as far as what you got as far as information back, and it sounds like it helped you make a decision

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Mike Padron: Yeah. I missed the last question. There you froze for just a second. Sorry

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Jesse Stakes: No problem.

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Jesse Stakes: I'm gonna give us a little pause here, just so I know where to edit it.

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Jesse Stakes: It sounds like your experience with bonamic, and with some of your fittings it's really given you a solidarity and choice. It's really given you a little bit more of a it's kind of confirmed something for you. It hasn't led to more questions per se

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Mike Padron: Well, I mean it definitely led to more questions. Only because it it brought in some balls that I wasn't even considering

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Mike Padron: and then, you know, when I kind of narrowed it down like I knew probably one x, even though it told me ideal for wedge spin. I knew there was no way I could use that ball off the Ti hit the ball way too high with way. Too much spin. That ball is gone, I mean, I'm I'm I will be donating a lot of balls to backyards if I did that so I kinda at that point I narrowed it down to those 3. It asked me to

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Mike Padron: the chrome tour, the staff model, and the Xv, and then the wall. I was playing the Tp. 5 X.

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Mike Padron: And I quickly. I quickly got rid of the T. Actually the one I was playing. Tp 5 x.

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Mike Padron: And I I've been playing for a year, and I always had issues around the green.

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Mike Padron: I can't ever get this thing to stop. My wedges don't ever seem to go where they want to, as far as on the green and stopping.

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Mike Padron: So that's where I kind of got went from there. And then I narrowed it down to finally 2 I'll I didn't actually do the staff model because it was just way too many choices. So I just decided, I'm gonna I'm gonna stick with chrome tour

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Mike Padron: and the and the strix on Xv.

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Mike Padron: Chrome tour I loved because of the triple track. So that's another reason, too. I looked at the balls. I like the preferences on there. So I did. I did the triple track. I played a couple of rounds with it, and then I took out the sprix on, and I actually, because of going back to their tool, I went to their their site.

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Mike Padron: and they fitted me every time, no matter how much I changed a little bit, answered a little bit here and there, like I didn't make myself a completely different golfer, but I just kind of changed a little bit here and there.

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Jesse Stakes: Nice

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Mike Padron: That I was kind of between 2 things, and it kept coming back with the strix on Z star diamond.

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Mike Padron: which is the ball. The ball that they made specifically for Brooks Koepka, and it kind of falls right in the middle of their

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Mike Padron: spinny, and they're, you know, almost like a left dash style ball on the Xv, and it's right there in the middle. And that's the one I ended up going with played 2 rounds of that. And I absolutely. I started doing nines and nines. So I can see on the same day, because I'm a different golfer every day. And and it was, I felt like it was apparent it was

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Mike Padron: even when I feel like I mishit it a little bit. It kind of stayed its path.

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Mike Padron: It checked up on the greens it spun back sometimes it was. It was the bull eyed

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Mike Padron: that I went with, and that's what I'm going with. I have.

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Mike Padron: you know I actually ordered them through the golf balls.com feel a little plug there, because golfballs.com. Does that line for you? The alignment excel, or the align excel. So it comes preprinted on there, and I've had no issues with that since. So it's been. It's been good. So that was my my whole thing. It took a while, I mean, it took that took a couple of months

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Mike Padron: to get it all done, but you know for at least for at least 2025. That's what I'm gonna stick with, and and go from there

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Jesse Stakes: So just stick with whatever Brooks is playing from now on. And you should be okay.

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Jesse Stakes: Yeah, I don't know. I'm you bet

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Mike Padron: The problem is, he's the same, almost the same golfer every time I am

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Jesse Stakes: Okay.

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Mike Padron: Different from 2024 to 2025 to, I know, for 2026. It's going to be 3 different people, so

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Mike Padron: it may be a different ball come that year, but alright

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Jesse Stakes: You brought up you brought up something that's very interesting to me is is the alignment part of it. Because and I and I saw a video not that long ago. Where they were. They were talking about the fact that, like

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Jesse Stakes: when you, when you use alignment aids on the ball. You can get very intrinsic with the way that you think about putting. And that's not something we talked about at all. Here is like, as far as like what graphics are printed on the ball or what they use is it really does affect how you approach putting. And some people are very extrinsic, and they look at the environment. They kind of, you know. Observe a line or picture a line, and they just go. And they're not really line focused. Whereas some people

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Jesse Stakes: they're, you know, you think about things like aim, point, and stuff like that, where people are really kind of focused on trying to pick a spot, and and how you know, walk off a putt, whatever it is, but it's like they're much more intrinsic, whether where they're focused on how they're thinking about the putt instead of what they're seeing just out in the environment. So I think that that's something that bears mentioning, because different balls have different alignments, and, as you said, you can order them with custom alignments if you order them from the right place.

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Mike Padron: Yeah, absolutely. And I'm a huge. I've tried it without lining up. I just. I'm not very good at

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Mike Padron: using just the putter

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Mike Padron: and and looking down the line to do it. So I have to have some sort of line. And just that's what I've always liked

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Mike Padron: and not only that it gives me feedback immediately. As soon as I hit that putt

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Mike Padron: like I played. I played this morning, and I missed a lot of putts within, you know, 6, 7 feet that I normally would probably make.

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Mike Padron: but I knew it wasn't the putt, because the the line was perfectly into rent. I just couldn't read it for anything, and I was. I was just lipping everything out because I was just playing too much break or not enough break or and the line told me. Look, you're putting it fine. You're rolling it. Well.

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Mike Padron: you're just. You're not hitting your your spot. Or you're misreading your spot, I guess. So. That's why I like the line. I think it gives you a lot of feedback. But I did see that recently where a lot of people are going away from it, or even going like the line, almost like the club face of the ball of the club face of the putter

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Mike Padron: and doing a kind of like a perpendicular to it.

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Mike Padron: In that app.

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Mike Padron: Never tried it. So I I just I need the line to be able to tell me where I'm going

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Jesse Stakes: Yeah, it's weird, because I'm almost the opposite with some of that stuff. And it's I have tried to become very analytical with putting. Just because I'm like I can improve this. I'm not doing well enough with it, but but just naturally, like most of my putters that I've ever had. Don't have a line on them. They have no type of alignment aid like, and then I have. I've always tried to just like when I especially if I'm putting poorly, or if I'm getting too much in my head, I try to put the

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Jesse Stakes: not to where I can't see anything but the white of the ball down, and then it allows me to kind of just look, observe, and putt quick like not

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Jesse Stakes: correct.

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Jesse Stakes: but just just like what I see. Just like that old Dave Stockton thing where it's like. It's how do you write your signature? You just go. You don't think about making a J, and then an e, and then an s.

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Mike Padron: Right.

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Jesse Stakes: And then an E, you just sign your signature. And the same way I try to. I've always tried to think about my putting the same way that being said in the last year, I've tried some different things to get a little bit more analytical, and I don't know that it fits me. I think sometimes I get lost in it, and I get too stuck in my own head rather than really just observing what's in front of me and going.

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Jesse Stakes: You know. I think all of these things are important, and I think we kind of scratched the surface on. You know a little bit of a lot of things here. But do you think that this is good for the consumer like, do you think that, like a lot of choices like this or something. Is it good for people, or is it just kind of death by a thousand paper cuts sometimes

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Mike Padron: Yeah, I mean, I think it's paper cuts for sure. No, I think it's good. I mean, I guess, to have to have options is always good.

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Mike Padron: a lot of these. There's a lot more golf ball brands that have popped up recently that that maybe we didn't see. That was that was gonna happen. I could see that being a little too much. And you don't know

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Mike Padron: you. You tend to trust or go towards the big names first, st and there could be some smaller names that are just as good

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Mike Padron: and are making are making it

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Mike Padron: a a premium ball just like anybody else, but because they don't have the marketing, or they don't have the you know the name. It's they get kind of looked over. But I mean, I think it's good, obviously, to have options and then once you.

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Mike Padron: it's just it's a pain in the butt to go through it all for sure.

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Mike Padron: But it's good to have different options. I think some of the companies out there are just getting way

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Mike Padron: way. Too many options.

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Mike Padron: I think, by the Bridgestone has

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Mike Padron: an obscene amount of of premium like their premium line. The Tour B just has.

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Mike Padron: I think, 6 or 7 in there, and just the Tour B models, and it's just that's A, that's just a lot

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Mike Padron: tireless, timeless. You got pro v. 1 pro v. 1 x, and left dash and left dash is really only for specific people.

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Mike Padron: Chrome tour you got chrome tour and chrome tour X and the chrome soft. So it's like.

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Mike Padron: I think some of them within the golf ball companies. They've gotten some of them gotten way, too many choices, and I just can't imagine for for sales. It's good, but

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Mike Padron: you know, I guess if it stays profitable they'll keep doing it. It's a billion dollar industry

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Jesse Stakes: 100%. I mean, when I think about it as a sport, and you and I both played baseball

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Jesse Stakes: for a long time, growing up, and it's everybody used the same ball. Everybody used, you know, a similar bat as a kid, but it all boils down to wood when you get to become a professional, and I always think you know, some standardization within a sport really makes talent shine. And but it's like I think about like, if you're you know, when you talk about spin per se on a baseball, you watch Roger Clemens so a 4 seam fastball, or you watch Pedro Martinez sit there and ride seams and make something tail 1218 inches, left or right.

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Jesse Stakes: and it's like they had to do it with the same baseball, and I think that's the one thing that with golf everything is so customized and there's no standardization of the golf ball, at least not yet. They're talking about that as potentially being something that happens at the professional game. But it really does allow people to try to dial in some of their misses, or some of the things that they may do, that another person doesn't.

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Jesse Stakes: It's another. It's another spot, you know. Clubs. It's it's the ball everywhere where they can kind of fix their. You know whether it's grip size any of that stuff. They can try to fix some of their misses before they even take swing one. So I think that that's you know it's interesting, and I think that to your point I don't think it's a i don't think choice is a bad thing for the market, but I think sometimes it can be overwhelming.

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Jesse Stakes: But I also from a business perspective in today's world, you know, there's so many opportunities for white labeled construction of golf balls and different things like that. You're seeing all kinds of companies give rise to a quote unquote premium, Urethane golf ball

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Mike Padron: I'd argue they're probably most of them are probably made in the same factory somewhere in Korea or China, or somewhere.

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Mike Padron: I can totally see that, and that's the thing. You don't know what the difference is. And a lot of times

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Mike Padron: you think. Oh, this one's better, and only because it's a titleist on it, or tailor made, or whatever your preferences. And yeah, I think it's gotten. It's gotten

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Mike Padron: not out of control yet. But you know you mentioned. It's interesting to see what's gonna happen here in in the pro game, and how that's gonna trickle down, because

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Mike Padron: you start, you know.

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Mike Padron: making it to conform to one ball like in baseball or one parameter of balls. It's gonna change a lot

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Jesse Stakes: No doubt.

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Mike Padron: That's a huge difference in what what we're doing now, and I don't know. Obviously it may not trickle down to us. But we're not gonna be wanting to be out there like, Oh, yeah, we're shooting this. Yeah, you're not playing pro ball. You're like, well, that's true. Like, it's

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Mike Padron: but it's true, like, yeah, you're playing with a different kind of ball. That's that's not fair. So I get it. I mean, I just don't know how it's a trickle down. That's a whole different conversation, if if and when that happens. But

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Jesse Stakes: Podcast my friend, yeah, absolutely.

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Jesse Stakes: all right, man, before we wrap this up, anything else you want to say about about balls before we get done

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Mike Padron: No, I think good. I think you said something I used golf balls to look into. I I think they're okay. I think

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Mike Padron: especially starting out for somebody who just wants to get the game going doesn't really care a lot about losing them or the performance as much. Just trying to get good swing on the ball. That's perfect way to go. Go buy some, use golf balls, buy some X outs whatever you can. Just to keep the cost down and just get out there and play and swing it. Obviously, as you get

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Mike Padron: later in the game, and you're keeping a ball long, long time. 4, 5, 6, 9 holes, 10 holes, whatever it is. You're gonna want something that's gonna last.

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Mike Padron: So that's the only thing I would say also, on those used golf balls, is just again. That's gonna depend on

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Mike Padron: on the person really

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Jesse Stakes: Yeah, I think it's a great point. I mean, the whole point is to go out and enjoy yourself. I mean, unless you're making, unless somebody's cutting you a check to play the game. The whole point is to have fun

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Mike Padron: Yep, absolutely.

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Jesse Stakes: All right, man, we'll catch you. We'll catch you down the road

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Mike Padron: Everybody appreciate it. Thank you.

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Mike Padron: Okay.